Why An Obama Second Term Could Mean No More Groton Sub Base

John Sheehan April 5, 2012 at 02:38 pm

Bud - I have to disagree with you. Whether President Obama is reelected to a second term or not, there will have to be defense cuts to help balance the budget and reduce the deficit. The key is getting main Navy to change the BRAC selection program that was used in the last three BRACs. Hopefully, the lobbyists paid by the State, and our Congressional delegation are working on that goal right now.

Waterford Rez April 6, 2012 at 01:05 am

But Bill, then Sen. Obama promised to end the influence of lobbyist.
“What's most outrageous is not the morally offensive conduct on behalf of these lobbyists and legislators, but the morally offensive laws and decisions that get made as a result," Obama said, as reported by the Chicago Tribune. (during his campaign). Nancy Pelosi promised to "drain the swamp" of corruption (by GOP). Now that Pres. Obama is in office and the Dems control the Senate, lobbyist have no influence. Not sure what they can do. I mean after all, the AFL-CIO, UAW and AFSCME clearly have no influence (wink wink), how can little ol' SECT have a fighting chance. Don't kid yourself Bill, I know in your eye, Obama can do no wrong, but if he gets in, not only will the sub base shut down, so will the entire country under MASSIVE debt. This man is making Jimmy Carter look like George Washington. Like Margaret Thatcher said "The problem with Socialism is eventually you run out of everyone else money".

Waterford Rez April 6, 2012 at 01:06 am

PS: Here’s a full list of Obama’s union endorsements and the dates on which they were announced. I am sure none of them employ lobbyist though, they just like his jump shot.
National Education Association (NEA) – July 4, 2011 United Food and Commercial Workers (UFCW) – October 20, 2011 National Air Traffic Controllers Association (NATCA) – November 16, 2011 Retail, Wholesale and Department Store Union (RWDSU) – November 17, 2011 Service Employees International Union (SEIU) – November 19, 2011 American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees (AFSCME) – December 6, 2011 Communications Workers of America (CWA) – February 2, 2012 American Federation of Teachers (AFT) – February 7, 2012 International Association of Machinists (IAM) – February 24, 2012 United Association of Journeymen and Apprentices of the Plumbing and Pipefitting Industry (UA) – March 1, 2012 United Steel Workers (USW) – March 4, 2012 Laborers International Union of North America (LIUNA) – March 8, 2012 AFL-CIO – March 13, 2012 http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/03/afl-cio-labor-unions-line-up-behind-obama/

Waterford Rez April 6, 2012 at 01:08 am

And SECT is going to compete with them? Maybe if the sailors built solar panels we would have a chance.

John Sheehan April 6, 2012 at 02:26 am

I know that many believe that unions are the reason that the country is in trouble. Just think, without unions there would be no minimum wage, no child labor laws, no restrictions on the work week, and no retirement benefits for workers - just the owners. Sounds great!! To be serious, unions are the major reason that there is a strong middle class in the US. The weakening of the unions over the past thirty years has led to a weakening of that middle class which has been highlighted by the "great recession of 2007-2009". The SUBASE will survive if we are able to again prove its military worth to the country. I believe that wlll be an easy sell if we work hard to be prepared to make that sale. The reelection of President Obama does not guarentee the base will be shutdown just like the election of a "President" Romney or a "President" Santorum will guarentee that the base will not be shutdown.

Waterford Rez April 6, 2012 at 03:29 am

John, nice try. You can't prove a negative. We can't prove what life would be like without unions (unfortunately). All of those things could be and would probably be in place without all the untended consequences of unions. Yes, maybe they had a time and place, but just like the horse and buggy, unions have out lived their value. Nearly every town and city and state in America is going bankrupt because of unions with all the insane wages and benefits and all the politicians that are bought and paid for with union dues.
My point was however that Pres. Obama campaigned on ending influence in politics and now a leading democrat in Waterford is stating that influence, i.e.money (lobbyist lining politicians pockets with donations) may be the very entity that saves the base! My, have things changed in 3 short years. Let's "hope" that the status of the sub base doesn't "change" in the future

Jean April 6, 2012 at 10:45 am

Mr. Sheehan seems to look at unions through his rose-colored glasses. He sees only the good and ignores the bad. Protecting basic rights of workers is good. Greed (pension spiking, pensions in excess of $100k) at tax payer expense is bad. Who is looking out for the taxpayer these days?

Patricia April 6, 2012 at 11:09 am

NOBODY

John Sheehan April 6, 2012 at 01:54 pm

To be clear, the lobbyists that the State has hired in Washington don't spread tax dollars to Congress persons. They spend their time monitoring legislation, administration actions, and developing relationships with folks in the Executive Branch that take actions that effect the State of Connecticut. All States and many cities and towns employ such lobbyists to help watch out for their interests. It is not the best system in the world and you would expect the legislative delegation to handle much of that heavy lifting. We have to deal with the system in place and do the best we can for Connecticut.

LadyMaMa April 8, 2012 at 11:36 am

The last time BRAC was an issue for this area was in 2005, during the presidency of George W. Bush. The matter of whether the Groton Sub Base should be closed or realigned will come up every eight years or so REGARDLESS of who is president.

augie42 April 9, 2012 at 10:32 am

Actually, it will make a difference. This President has already said he would go around Congress if he had to....Look at his track record....If you don't get the results you want, twist arms, play tricks and go around the normal process. For instance, the health care law, Non-recess appointments and even recently how he is coercing the Supreme Court. WE MUST BE PREPARED!!

John Maloney April 9, 2012 at 04:21 pm

When are people going to learn that the president can't actually do anything without congressional approval? He can't just make something happen on his own. Obamacare isn't here just because of the president. The president doesn't decide if a base is going to close or now. He can influence congress and propose things that he wants, but it's up to the idiots that we keep electing in congress to say yes or no. Yes, the president can veto bills that congress approves, but congress can override that if they have the majority. But since congress is controlled by the democrats and the house seems to be controlled by the republicans, and both parties are controlled by big businesses, nothing will get done.

augie42 April 9, 2012 at 04:39 pm

Mr Maloney, You need to open your eyes as what this president is doing to the country. The Secretary of Defense (Panetta) said the president may not even go through Congress....HELLO?...LOOK at what he is doing now in Health care: The Obama administration is quietly diverting roughly $500 million to the IRS to help implement the president’s healthcare law. The money is only part of the IRS’s total implementation spending, and it is being provided outside the normal appropriations process. The tax agency is responsible for several key provisions of the new law, including the unpopular individual mandate. Republican lawmakers have tried to cut off funding to implement the healthcare law, at least until after the Supreme Court decides whether to strike it down. That ruling is expected by June, and oral arguments last week indicated the justices might well overturn at least the individual mandate, if not the whole law. ("The Hill 4-9-12")
GET IT?...The ends justifies the means with this guy...Do your research.

John Maloney April 9, 2012 at 05:49 pm

First off, I did not post anything on here to start a flame war. I posted my view of the situation. If by doing research, you mean reading the biased and alarmist new stories from our impartial news agencies in today’s media, then I will have to refuse. They don’t write news to tell people facts; they write news to get ratings and advertising dollars. I don’t want the base to close, I work on the base, but blaming Obama for everything that sucks in today’s world is just plain crazy.
I am not supporting Obama or bashing Obama. I don't really care. I'm just tired of everyone saying he's ruining the country, when he's not the one doing it. It's the political parties and people in congress that don't vote for what their constituents want, but for the money that lands in their pockets.

REVMAN April 9, 2012 at 07:53 pm

They gave 500 million of OUR tax dollars to the IRS already for healthcare that may be unconstitutional. Do we get it back???

augie42 April 9, 2012 at 10:27 pm

JM,
A word of advice, when you argue for something, use SPECIFIC facts to support your arguement. Otherwise you look like an extremeist thats stands for nothing but bashing. If you don't believe anything you read, then you should be a hermit...your comments are a cop-out. Believe in something and take a stand. Join a PAC, go to local town meetings....make a difference...not a face-less blog. Political parties and Congress are not going away anytime soon, If you do not like it, help change it. Otherwise move to Canada.

John Maloney April 9, 2012 at 11:57 pm

Obviously it is not ok to have an opinion here. If you disagree with the right wing people on here, you have no life or don't believe anything. At least I used my real name on here and didn't hide behind some made up online persona. I guess you can learn everything about someone just by reading 2 posts on a website. I thought I was doing what everyone else was doing, stating their opinion about the original story and for doing that I get slammed and called extremis and a hermit. Have fun with that, augie42. You can move to whatever country you want, just stay away from anyone that disagrees with you. Evidently they make you have a bad time or something. Yay. Signing off, don’t bother responding to this, I have already stopped reading what you type.

Norbert V. Fay April 10, 2012 at 12:52 am

John...please don't stop comminicating. If you're military you know that Submarines, the base itself, and even the private company EB, take on the attitudes, the values, and the operating philosophy, of their Commanding Officer, or the company President. You can check, but up until last November, both houses of Congress were solidly Democratic, from 2007 till 2010. The President should be held responsible for what happens on his watch. You may not like it, but employees or crew members, often do things that please their Captain or President. That reflect the values of the person in charge. The GSA fiasco, where people made fun of the fact that they could spend our money with abandon and not suffer any consequence, has the same operating handbook, as the billions spent in "Green Energy", with a solid list of failures as the result. When the "Boss" has litle respect for the hard working individual, it shoudn't be a surprise that his employee's operate with same sentiment. Don't give up comminicating, reach out there's a great pool of truthful information available for you out there.

Kendall Svengalis April 10, 2012 at 04:42 pm

The question of the Groton Sub Base is one that exposes the hypocrisy of Democrat politicians. They are generally hostile to the military except when they have to fool local voters that they DO like the local presence of the military. While we have to be circumspect about what wars we get involved in, the existence of a strong military force and the projection of U.S. force is essential to peace in many areas of the world. And the U.S. Navy and its submarine force is an essential part of that projection. But when Obama wants to gut the military, he emboldens our enemies.
Forced unionization is anathema to the American way of life. While individuals should be free to join a union, no one should be forced to join one against their will. From that coercion flows all sorts of negative consequences, including forced union dues, the use of those dues to support candidates opposed by many in the rank and file, and union violence and intimidation against those who oppose their agenda. In the public sector, union influence as a result of coerced membership and dues has thoroughly corrupted the electoral process. Unions buy off Democrat politicians with taxpayer-provided dues to support their political agenda, thereby further sticking it to the taxpayers. Taxpayers are often not effectively represented at the bargaining table. FDR warned of the problems of public sector unions, but the results have been far more insidious than even he imagined.

Kendall Svengalis April 10, 2012 at 04:59 pm

Jean: I agree with you that no one is looking out for the taxpayers interests. I grew up in a union family (Steelworkers), but have seen the union movement grow out of control and far beyond issues of collective bargaining. The fact is that unions have moved far beyond protecting basic workers rights (most of which are now protected by federal legislation) and used their monopoly power to advance a selfish agenda, particularly in the public ector. In the private sector, union demands must be tempered to correspond to economic realities. If unions get too greedy, the company and their jobs will suffer. But in the public sector, there are no similar economic calculations, just taxpayers to be milked. And if the unions have a large, coerced, membership base, they have a significant source of campaign cash to buy off Democrat (overwhelmingly) politicians to help with the milking. In every state in the nation that is suffering fiscal problems, public sector unions and their excessive demands are the chief culprits. Today, leftists have taken control of most unions because they thrive in an atmosphere based on coercion, rather than free will. At the very least, unions members should assert their "Beck" rights and get back that portion of their dues used for political purposes. No one should be forced to support any candidate against their will.

Waterford Rez April 10, 2012 at 05:23 pm

Kendall is SPOT ON! Bravo!

Ryan April 12, 2012 at 11:47 pm

Should we start a war (ahem Romney v. Iran) so that we can keep a sub base? Or should we evaluate its worth to us, and if its no longer needed than every taxpayer saves money, and military families can keep their sons and daughters?
I understand it is a cornerstone of our local economy, and without it southeastern connecticut would never look the same, but its analogous to a town who once thrives on harvesting asbestos: its no longer necessary, they have no right to just keep doing it "because they always have." We have the power to adapt, the workforce can be put to healthy use in another field, say clean energy technologies. Anybody see it?

augie42 April 13, 2012 at 12:08 pm

Anyone who says start a war to keep the base has no clue about why we have a defense department. Where you asleep in history class? As a matter of fact I am offended by these comments being a veteran. Freedom isn't free. We live in the greatest country in the world. Look around the world....would you rather live in Mexico? Moreover, the "Romney" plug, what is that?....foreshadowing?....I'll agree with 1/2 of it...Romney will be prez....but a war with Iran would be in part of the poor foreign policy of the current admin.
The world is a cruel place. If you do not have the military power to secure your country and its interests abroad, you get taken over or controlled. I agree that we need to diversify our local economy. But cutting a huge part of the defense infastructure would put our country back 100 years. Green energy is good start, but it will NEVER come close to meeting our energy needs in our lifetime. Your analogy of asbestos was a poor attempt to portray your opinion. Asbestos has a 20-30 year latentcy....the military knows their missions before they leave.